A.D. 30 or A.D. 33?

In writing about the time when two thousand years will have expired since the death and resurrection of Christ, I have accepted the view of others that Christ was crucified in A.D. 30. However, the linked writer is certain that it is A.D. 33. "April 3, AD 33: Why We Believe We Can Know the Exact Date Jesus Died" (See here)

If Christ did die in A.D. 33, then we should look for the coming of Christ in A.D. 33 and not A.D. 30 as I have stated along with others. 

Further, there is a beginning and ending to the "coming" (parousia) of the Lord Jesus. Just as the first coming of the Lord involved thirty three years, so too his second coming will span years. See my posts here and here.

Beliefs about the Afterlife (xxiv)

Thus far we have established the fact that - 

1. There is an afterlife for the spirits of the departed dead  

2. There is a future resurrection for the bodies of the dead 

3. Between death and the resurrection a person is in an intermediate state 

4. Before the death and resurrection of Christ all dead souls went to the Underworld 

{This is the teaching of the old testament and of most ancient civilizations. All departed spirits went to Sheol (Hebrew) or Hades (Greek), which refer to the same place (Hades is the new testament word for the Hebrew word Sheol) and this is generally defined as "place/world of the dead."}

5. The place of the departed spirits of the dead (Hades) was a place of rest and delight for the righteous and a place of torment for the unrighteous 

6. Christ descended into Hades in his disembodied spirit when his body died 

7. Christ emptied Hades of all the righteous dead so that Hades now is the place where only the unrighteous dead go 

8. Christ became the forerunner into the "third heaven," or "Paradise," being the place where the righteous now go in spirit when they die. 

We also looked at some important biblical texts concerning the afterlife and resurrection. We also saw how the bible does not teach soul sleep nor soul annihilation, or the views of the Sadducees. We saw how the bible taught the immortality of the soul, a belief also held to by such Pagans as Greek philosopher Socrates. We also saw how the bible taught the doctrine of punishment in the afterlife, even of eternal punishment. In this chapter we will discuss whether there be degrees of punishment in Hell. 

Questions

1) How can there be degrees of punishment in Hell when it is equally "eternal" for all? If all are equally in the fires of Hell, how then can one be more in the fire than others? 

2) Since each doomed soul has lost all good, how then can any single one have more or less good than another? Does "eternal" not only designate the duration of the ordained punishment but the quality of that punishment too? So that "eternal punishment" includes also the idea of "infinite in kind and degree"? 

3) The words of James 2: 10 enter into the discussion of this question. "For whoever keeps the whole law but fails in one point has become guilty of all of it." (Jam. 2: 10) Does that not say that all are equally guilty?

4) Does it not seem that there cannot be degrees of punishment since all are receiving the nth degree of suffering?

5) Do not the scriptures imply that the punishment received in the day of judgment is proportionate to the degree of sin committed? 

6) Do the prisoners of Hell not get some good out of conversing with their fellow prisoners? Or, will they all be in "solitary confinement"?

Let us begin our investigation into possible answers to these questions by city from Got Questions Christian web page (here), where they say (emphasis mine):

"The idea that there are different levels of punishment in hell is graphically portrayed in The Divine Comedy, written by Dante Alighieri between 1308 and 1321. In that poem, the Roman poet Virgil guides Dante through the nine circles of hell. The circles are concentric, representing a gradual increase in wickedness, and culminating at the center of the earth, where Satan is held in bondage. Each circle’s sinners are punished in a fashion befitting their crimes. Each sinner is afflicted for all of eternity by the chief sin he committed. According to Dante, the circles range from the first circle, where dwell the unbaptized and virtuous pagans, to the very center of hell reserved for those who have committed the ultimate sin—treachery against God."

Are there nine levels (floors) in the Underworld of Hades as Dante envisioned? Who knows for sure? That there are levels we have already established. Recall that "Tartarus" was the lowest level of Hades and this is where the fallen angels are kept chained. Further, we saw where Lazarus and Dives were on different levels, Lazarus being on the higher side of the gulf and Dives on the lower side. That is at least three levels. Whether sinners in Hades (or finally in Gehenna) suffer particular punishments for particular characteristic sins as envisioned by Dante, one cannot say for sure. 

The article continues:

"Although the Bible does not specifically say there are different levels of punishment in hell, it does seem to indicate that the judgment will indeed be experienced differently for different people. In Revelation 20:11–15, the people are judged “according to what they had done as recorded in the books” (Revelation 20:12). All the people at this judgment, though, are thrown into the lake of fire (Revelation 20:13–15). So, perhaps, the purpose of the judgment is to determine how severe the punishment in hell will be."

I agree with that, but affirm that it still does not answer all the questions raised about the chief question, as enumerated above. Further, if "the day of judgment" in the passages at the heading of this post/chapter refers not to the final great white throne judgment after the Millennium but to that period of time described in the Apocalypse that John the apostle wrote, of the tribulation years of that prophetic "day" of wrath associated with the coming of the "presence" of Christ, then it would not necessarily apply for eternity. During the day of wrath (spanning the years of the Book of Revelation or time of "great tribulation") it will be harder on some nations, cities, and towns, than for others. I believe that both are no doubt true. 

There will be degrees of punishment in the day of judgment that precedes the Millennial reign of Christ and there will be degrees of punishment decreed for those to be condemned to eternal torment at the great white throne judgment (Rev. 20) that follows the Millennium. But, I would not be too dogmatic on the point. We still need to answer the questions raised in our minds by such a belief, which I will do in the next chapter.

The article continues:

"A clearer passage is Luke 10, where Jesus speaks of comparative punishment. First, Jesus says this about a village that rejects the gospel: “I tell you, it will be more bearable on that day for Sodom than for that town” (verse 12). Then He speaks to Bethsaida and Chorazin: “It will be more bearable for Tyre and Sidon at the judgment than for you” (verse 14). Whatever punishment the former residents of Sodom, Tyre, and Sidon were experiencing in hell, the Galilean towns that refused to hear Christ would experience more. The level of punishment in hell seems to be tied to the amount of light a person rejects."

The question here is what is meant by "that day"? The question depends on what is intended by "the judgment" or "day of judgment"  or "that day" in those passages, as we just noted. The words highlighted in red above also seems to me to be the truth. 

The article continues:

"Another indication that hell has different levels of punishment is found in Jesus’ words in Luke 12: “The servant who knows the master’s will and does not get ready or does not do what the master wants will be beaten with many blows. But the one who does not know and does things deserving punishment will be beaten with few blows. From everyone who has been given much, much will be demanded; and from the one who has been entrusted with much, much more will be asked” (verses 47–48)."

I believe this is one of the best proofs for the idea that there will be degrees of punishment, and perhaps of kinds of punishment. The punishment is proportionate. 

It also seems just and right. A young man who dies in unbelief and impenitence and yet who was not overly sinful through immoral conduct should not suffer more than say Stalin, Hitler, or Mao, or Judas.

In an Internet article on our subject I found this article - "Are There Degrees of Sin and Punishment in Hell?" by Mary Fairchild (here). She offers insightful thoughts on this area of our subject and in answer to her question (emphasis mine):

"That's a tough question. For believers, it stirs up doubts and concerns about the nature and justice of God. But that's precisely why it's a great question to consider. A 10-year-old boy in the scenario brings up a topic known as age of accountability, however, we'll save that for another study. The Bible gives us only limited information about Heaven, Hell, and the afterlife." 

I certainly agree. It is indeed a great question for us to muse upon and we should be thankful for the information God has revealed to us, limited as it is now. Further, curiosity in itself is not always a bad thing as respects bible study. How many sinners have been saved and converted by picking up the bible for the first time out of curiosity only to end up believing it? How many sinners have come to church or camp meeting out of curiosity and left born again? Yes, "curiosity can kill the cat" but not always. God has his "secret things" and these are things he has not revealed (as the text says - Deut. 29: 29) and we should not pry into those things. We ought not to be given to speculation but be moderate (for all speculation is not bad either). But, who can help but be curious about eternal punishment and the justice of God in the day of judgment?

She wrote further:   

"There are some aspects of eternity we'll never fully understand, at least on this side of Heaven. God simply has not revealed everything to us through Scripture. Yet, the Bible does seem to suggest varying degrees of punishment in Hell for unbelievers, just as it speaks of different rewards in Heaven for believers based on deeds done here on earth."

I do agree that this is the teaching of scripture.

She wrote further:   

"The Bible does not expressly state that a person's punishment in Hell is based on the seriousness of his or her sins. The idea, however, is implied in several places."

I again agree and believe that the scriptures typically cited to prove it, as at the heading of this chapter, and in those referred to under its head, do indicate it. 

In the next chapter we will continue our look at this aspect of our subject of the afterlife.

Is It True What the Old Saints Predicted?

In my 50+ years of bible study I have read lots of writings by Christian writers over the past two thousand years. I have also been in conversations with many such folks in my lifetime. Many of those writers and people, especially preachers and teachers of the word, have said that they thought that "more light would be given to end time believers" regarding end time events and second coming texts of scripture. I always felt that way also. But I never tried to put together all my increasing thoughts on that subject (which I may do in the future) but I have shown, over the past few years, how at least a few passages support that idea, such as: 1) the rising of the Day Star in the hearts of end time believers, and 2) the knocking of Christ at the door just prior to his return or entering into our world, 3) Etc.

True born again believers, like all of creation, are in labor pains for the coming of the Lord. (Romans 8) Are your labor pains telling you that the birth is now imminent?

Well, if that is true, why scoff at other Christians who may be in the process of receiving that greater light on the subject of the second coming of Christ?

What think ye?

Date Setter?

"Behold, I will send you Elijah the prophet before the coming of the great and dreadful day of the LORD." (Mal. 4: 5)

"And Jesus answered and said unto them, Elias truly shall first come, and restore all things." (Matt. 17: 11)

"Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times. And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself." (Dan. 9: 25-26 kjv)

"And, behold, there was a man in Jerusalem, whose name was Simeon; and the same man was just and devout, waiting for the consolation of Israel: and the Holy Ghost was upon him. And it was revealed unto him by the Holy Ghost, that he should not see death, before he had seen the Lord's Christ." (Luke 2: 25-26)

What do these verses have in common? 

1. They show that the people living in the days preceding the first coming of the Lord should have known the time when Christ would be born. They should have known at least the year (and even the day as I believe along with others). 

2. Simeon was given special revelation about the time of Christ' return, believing that Christ would come before he died. I have no doubt that many of the saints who live unto the second coming of the Lord will also be given revelation of Christ coming in their days.

3. The coming of Elijah in the person of John the Baptist signaled that Christ was coming on the heels of the Baptist heralding his arrival. 

4. Elijah will come again also, in a more literal way than in the Baptist, and before the second coming of Christ, for he is one of the two witnesses who appear before the visible coming of Christ in the heavens as the Apocalypse shows.

Those who scoff at those of us who believe that we can know the time of the second coming (for we know the signs of his coming, or the times and seasons, so that the day of the Lord will come as we are expecting) are harming themselves and others who are only following scripture. Yes, we do not know the day or hour of the second coming of the Lord, but to say that we cannot know the season, and perhaps the year (2030) is denying what was the pattern that was set for his first coming. 

Someone cries - "every date setter so far has been wrong." Ergo, all date setting is wrong.

How fallacious is this reasoning! If we followed it we would have to say that because a weatherman was wrong on one of his/her forecasts (predictions) we should therefore think he/she can never be right. The same with those who make economic forecasts. Why is all religious forecasting of prophetic events to be rejected? So what if some false prophets gave false prophecies, or false interpretations of prophecies? That fact does not mean all predicting is to be ignored.

Jesus said his coming would be like a woman being in travail (labor pains). Doctors predict the time when a newly conceived baby will be born, even giving a "due date" for the birth. Many times a mother gives birth before the "due date" and some after. Very few doctors miss being right in forecasting the month of the birth. So too we may not know the exact day or hour of the Lord's coming, but when the travail of our planet begins (Rom. 8: 22-23), we will then know the coming forth of the baby is immediate.

 

Was Daniel a date setter for giving the time when Christ would be born? Was John the Baptist a date setter? Was Hosea who said "after two days he will revive us" and "in the third day he will raise us up and live in his sight"? (Hosea 6: 1-2)

Preparing For An Angrier World?

WEF founder, and a chief conspirator to bring about the final empire of evil under the beast of Revelation, or Antichrist, Klaus Schwab, of Davos, Switzerland,  (the place where the wealthy ruling elite meet and plan their strategies under the direction of Lucifer or Satan) has said that the plan is to bring about a new world order where "you will own nothing and be happy" (of which I have written about before, as have others) and also has said that in carrying out the 2030 agenda that we "must prepare for an angrier world."

Yes, anger everywhere! Do we not see anger and wrath everywhere throughout the Book of Revelation during the time of "great tribulation"? I wrote the following about this in a post dealing with the rider on the red horse in Revelation (See here):

A Climate Of Rage

Having called attention to the central sin of hubris, and of the general lawlessness, violence, and widespread depravity of the last and most wicked generation, and of the other evils that attend that state (arrogance, insults, shaming the weak, etc.), we now enlarge upon those other sins of those "evil days," and of course, in doing so, we must speak of man's unjust wrath and rage, of which the apostle says - "the wrath of man does not produce the righteousness of God." (James 1: 20) The anger and wrath of depraved man will become a violent rage at the time of the Apocalypse.

Said the apostle Peter:

"Who by the mouth of thy servant David hast said, Why did the heathen rage, and the people imagine vain things? The kings of the earth stood up, and the rulers were gathered together against the Lord, and against his Christ. For of a truth against thy holy child Jesus, whom thou hast anointed, both Herod, and Pontius Pilate, with the Gentiles, and the people of Israel, were gathered together, For to do whatsoever thy hand and thy counsel determined before to be done." (Acts 4: 25-28 citing Psalm 2: 1)

This literally occurred when Christ's enemies were "enraged against" him as Peter describes. But, such a thing not only characterized the mass of the peoples when Christ came the first, but will also characterize the state of the masses (and their leaders) at the time when the first seal opens, at Christ's coming the second. The rulers and the people in general will be filled with rage. The word "rage" (Greek ἐφρύαξαν) is interesting. "Only here in New Testament. Originally, to neigh or snort like a horse. Of men, to give one's self haughty airs, and to act and speak insolently." (Vincent's Word Studies) The Greek word was primarily used of "the snorting, neighing and prancing of horses;" hence, metaphorically, of "the haughtiness and insolence of men," Act 4:25. In the Sept., Psa 2:1." (Vine) Strong adds that it includes the idea of being "high-spirited," and of men "taking on lofty airs," and "behaving arrogantly," and being "tumultuous."

What a "social climate" that will be!

"And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth." (Rev. 11: 18 kjv)

There is a lot of anger and wrath, rage and outrage, in Revelation! There is the anger of "the nations (or races)," and the "wrath" of the devil (Rev. 12: 12), and of course lots of references to "the wrath of God" and "of the Lamb." Along with hubris is a society of angry hot tempered people.

We are on the verge of the wrath of God. Further, we are beginning to see the wrath of evil men and devils and I think Schwab is right about that. I wrote about that as what we see occurring under the red horse rider when people are killing each other.

"Surely the wrath of man shall praise thee: the remainder of wrath shalt thou restrain." 

(Psa. 76: 10)

Will You Hear Him Knocking?

"And ye yourselves like unto men that wait for their lord, when he will return from the wedding; that when he cometh and knocketh, they may open unto him immediately." (Luke 12: 36)

In talking about the rising of the "Day Star" in the hearts of believers in the time immediately preceding the parousia (coming presence) of Christ a few years back I wrote:

"Believing strongly as I do that I may yet see the coming of the Lord and of that glorious day, I am looking for the Lord's "knocking" and for the day star to rise in my heart! I look forward to being an eyewitness and participant in the events scheduled by God for the "end of days." Are you eagerly watching for the signs of his coming? Are you prepared for that day?" (See here) 

Two things will happen within the hearts of true believers in the days of Christ's coming, both immediately before it and during it: 1) The Day Star will arise in the hearts of believers (II Peter 1: 19), 2) Christ will "knock" at the doors of the hearts of believers, and of churches, and in other ways. 

Are you "on alert" for these things? (See my posting Sound The Alarm) I am beginning to sense the Day Star's rising and am perhaps beginning to hear the knocks of Christ at the door of our world. "The judge (Christ) stands before the door" said James. (James 5: 9) Will you be able to "open to him immediately" as a result of hearing the knocks? 

Gospel Tidbits from Dr. Bass

Dr. Jeremiah Bass, pastor of Cincinnati Primitive Baptist Church, has written some good posts in his daily blog post on the church's web page. Here are some excellent words from him. It expresses real Old or Primitive Baptist teaching, and the truth of the bible. 

"For we are not talking into a busy signal or a disconnected line, but through Christ we have access by one Spirit unto the Father (Eph. 2:18)." (The God Who Listens)

Praise the Lord for his loving us enough to listen to us! The Sovereign of the Universe always ready to hear us! All through Christ alone!

"All who are related to God's own Son by faith become by union with him the children of God, and with that all the blessings and privileges which that relation constitutes and implies."  (What manner of love)

That is a truly biblical ordo salutis and what our primitive Baptist forefathers taught (expressed in the London and Philadelphia confessions). 

"There is assurance to be had here. Our Heavenly Father is not pleased when we slump around in the shadows of doubt and uncertainty. Rather, we are meant to take him at his word and embrace through Christ this great gift of God's love to us." (Ibid)

Amen! No need to sing "Tis a point I long to know! Am I his or am I not?" 

2030 & Christ's Return

I just finished listening to a two hour video titled "Messiah 2030 ~ The Prophetic Messianic Timeline" (here) and I highly recommend that you take the time to watch it as the author, Clive Douglas Campbell, gives much evidence to show that the return of Christ occurs in 2030, a viewpoint shared by others, including myself. See the following posts on Hosea's two and three day prophecy (here) (here) (here). Campbell's video has been out a little over a month and it already has 539K views and 3,944 Comments. 

Below the video screen we have these words: 

"Dozens of Biblical prophecies not only point to the exact year of the Messiah's first coming (30 C.E.), but those same prophecies even point to the year of his return (2030 C.E.). It has all been hidden in plain sight for thousands of years."

And, 

"No man knows the day and hour of the Messiah's return, however the Bible makes it definitively clear we are to know the season (Matt 24: 32-36)." 

"This is a call for a watch, not setting a date. If your house is not in order, and you do not know our Savior, there is no time like the present. Timestamps to the 40 messianic timing prophecies covered in the film: 

1:54 The Creation Prophecy 18:10 The Sabbath Prophecy 21:10 The Four of Seven Prophecy 24:20 The Fourth Commandment Prophecy 24:54 The Hosea Prophecy 25:29 The Jubilee Principle 26:52 The Genesis 6 Prophecy 28:54 The Death of Moses Prophecy 29:50 The Jubilee Prophecy 33:25 The Exodus Prophecy 35:18 The 2,000 Cubits Prophecy 36:24 The Lazarus Prophecy 40:59 The Woman at the Well Prophecy 44:25 The Official’s Son Prophecy 46:40 The Good Samaritan Prophecy 47:53 The Fasting Prophecy 49:05 The Mount Sinai Prophecy 50:56 The Healing on the Sabbath Prophecy 52:10 Ascending the Mountain Prophecy 53:57 The Ascension Prophecy 54:54 The Transfiguration Prophecy 57:01 The Job Prophecy 57:49 The Temple Prophecy 1:06:29 The Servant Prophecy 1:08:11 The Land Rest Prophecy 1:08:49 The Appearing on the Seventh Day Prophecy 1:09:35 The David and Goliath Prophecy 1:12:10 The Wedding Day Prophecy 1:13:43 The Jonah Prophecy 1:18:45 The Jericho Prophecy 1:20:04 The Feeding of the Four Thousand Prophecy 1:23:04 The Esther Prophecy 1:25:06 The Three Measures of Leaven Prophecy 1:26:47 The Enoch Prophecy 1:27:50 The Birth Pang Prophecy 1:29:31 The Death, Burial, and Resurrection of Messiah in 30 C.E. 1:38:41 The Fig Tree Prophecy 1:42:07 The Eighth Day 1:42:36 The Circumcision Prophecy 1:47:13 The Sukkot Prophecy  

1:58:31 The Menorah Prophecy

I cannot say that I agree with Campbell on everything, but I can say that I cannot refute the evidence he puts forth for Christ' return in 2030. Is it not interesting that the year 2030 is also the time when the conspirators of the WEF and Davos, under the direction of Satan and Antichrist, put forth as the time when "you will own nothing and be happy"? The bold print on the list above I consider as very strong proofs.

In trying to find out biographical information on brother Campbell, I did find where he is from Manitoba and was born in 1952. I also found "AN OPEN LETTER TO THE WORLD" by Clive Campbell 03/31/23 (here) where he writes 

"As a Christian and fellow human being, I believe and feel that I would not be loving you well if I didn't tell you where I believe we are in human history. The Lord and Savior Jesus Christ was crucified, buried, rose and ascended, I am quite sure, in 30 AD. He rose at dawn of the 3rd day (Easter Sunday morning) to show that He would return as King of kings at dawn of the 3rd millennial "day," thus between Nisan 1, 2030 and Nisan 1, 2031. I am afraid the Bible tells us that the last 7 years before that, initiated by the Resurrection and Rapture of God's dead and living people to heaven, will be a horrendous time of God's judgment and wrath on sinful man, culminating in nuclear fire, no doubt. Thus, I believe that these 7 years will begin sometime between Nisan 1 (March 23), 2023, eight days ago, and Nisan 1 (April 9), 2024. The end-times signs abound: Israel's prophesied rebirth in 1948; 9/11 in 2001 ("trumpeting" the 29-year countdown to the Second Coming); COVID hitting Israel in 2020 ("trumpeting" the 10-year countdown to the Second Coming); Israel's prophesied war with Iran looming; the prophesied 10-state empire (the Commonwealth of Independent States, the CIS, the daughter of the 15-state USSR, with Russia at its head) on the scene; the assassination of Putin by the Jewish Antichrist (General Valery Gerasimov?) and his attack on Israel shaping up; not to mention the rampant evils of abortion, other murder, crime, violence, sexual immorality, gender confusion, etc." 

Again, I cannot say that I accept all his prophecy insights, however, I cannot disprove it. All he is doing is adding proofs to proofs, though some are stronger than others. I certainly do not believe in a pre tribulation rapture nor that the tribulation and day of judgment last only seven years (as I have written about). Christ coming involves many things. I don't think he is right about the ten kings/toes. I do think Antichrist will be Jewish (being Judas come back from the dead), but whether Gerasimov is he is not known. 

He also wrote:

"Below is a link to a video message on The Gospel of God, which I implore you to watch and listen to carefully. Please do the same with the 4 videos after it and even the ones before it, if you wish. Also, please share this letter with others. Thank you, in advance. 

https://www.ligonier.org/learn/series/handout-apologetics/the-gospel-of-god-3437 

Love and may God save you and yours,  A Christian and fellow human being, 

Clive Douglas Campbell

I don't know how connected doctrinally to Ligonier is Campbell. He does say - "Author requests article critique". 

Again, seeing how close we are to 2030, and seeing how things are happening so fast, with numerous prophetic signs, signs of the times, it certainly is worth your time to listen to it. It is time to get ready my brothers. Our redemption draws near.